Mikle

Cheating

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Many leaders of the rating enjoy an unfair exit from the race without losing points.
I can give examples. :)
I propose to stop this practice.

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You are cheating by being anonymous and even changing your anonymous number at each challenge... Before accusing some players start by being fair!

After that, for my self, I do not cheat, I use a feature of the game (and I am not alone).

epicure

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Il y a 7 heures, crapulle a dit :

I use a feature of the game (and I am not alone).

All my boats ALWAYS gain points honestly, sportily. (For me, there are not enough 16 races in two or three days.)

Refuse the shameful "feature" (artificial rating), dear professor, and I will stop your "negative PR".

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Most of the top players use this feature since months now! So now you arrive and you decide that we should stop (maybe only me ?), you are funny. By the way the feature is fair, you can use it and it is similar to the  "remove the worst race" rule in some real competition.

You should also know that it is far more easy (for a top player) to win a race as an anonymous boat than with a named boat. With epicure other players take a special care of me (without speaking of the pirates that like to kill the top player, and do not care that much about anonymous boat...).

You can use two named boats, one which is your top boat and an other because you want to run more races (I've this: epicure and fils d'epicure).

.epicure

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Il y a 5 heures, crapulle a dit :

By the way the feature is fair, you can use it and it is similar to the  "remove the worst race" rule in some real competition.

How many bad races do you throw out in this way in the regatta? One, two, three ...?

Il y a 5 heures, crapulle a dit :

You should also know that ...

I do not violate virtual rules, unlike you.

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il y a 41 minutes, Mikle a dit :

How many bad races do you throw out in this way in the regatta? One, two, three ...?

you can only do it for 1 race on each challenge... and this not cheating... before crying, you should start playing with an official boat and after let's tak

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Il y a 1 heure, LaMerNoire - BSP a dit :

you can only do it for 1 race on each challenge... and this not cheating... before crying, you should start playing with an official boat and after let's tak

And it should be a race after the 16th ...

Mikle, please, stop your accusation, and try to become an adult. I break no rules !

We all break the ISAF rules because VR break them, and you in particular, so are you cheating ?

Do you have something personal against me ? Strangely I remember no race against you... are you *really* cheating to avoid racing against top players ?

epicure

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Il y a 3 heures, LaMerNoire - BSP a dit :

you can only do it for 1 race on each challenge

Show me the proof, pls.

Il y a 3 heures, LaMerNoire - BSP a dit :

you should start playing with an official boat and after let's tak

Why?

Il y a 1 heure, crapulle a dit :

And it should be a race after the 16th ...

Where about this is written in the rules? Proof, pls.

 

Il y a 1 heure, crapulle a dit :

We all break the ISAF rules because VR break them

This is a completely different topic.

 

Il y a 1 heure, crapulle a dit :

Do you have something personal against me ?

Not only against you. The top racer should be a positive role model.

 

Il y a 1 heure, crapulle a dit :

are you *really* cheating to avoid racing against top players ?

It's funny. Look in the mirror. :D

---------------------------

 

 

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Hello Mikle, actually epicure is one of the most ethic player here so i can understand why he feel singled out for no specific reason.

We all learned how to play by VR particular rules and sometime awkard stuff..  such as weird rule 18 or proper course, and nothing is written anywhere and VR changes stuff as they please without telling anything to anyone, without caring for anyone, for better or for worst. ( history show it is often for the worst unfortunatly... )

now the stuff you feel is not right, is actually one of the thing i currently like the most in VRI, with a money time atmosphere at the end of the challenge where you are given one extra chance to improve your result. And allow to compensate for the randomness and erratic player behavior, pirate, fake penalty. I am sure you will soon also see this as a real feature of the game.

Especially when you encouter pirates around, such as the fucker that found funny to impersonate my boat and mess around, or the few others that raided the races as boatxxx to target players.  These are really improper behavior. ( Not saying it is you )

 

Indeed you should really start with an official boat because there is a ranking based on sum of every challenge ( the elo ranking you see is just a sick joke... ) 

this is the VR/SSL official ranking www.www.virtualstarsailors.com/ranking/regular  , it is currently waiting for VR to update. I fear VR grew a melonhead since they got wolrdsailing blessing unfortunatly, so i only have mild hopes here but they will get their senses eventually.

 

Anyway,  lets settle down here and enjoy sailing.

peace.

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I swear, Mikle is not me!... :$ :P :D

I understand his questions and surprises. But I agree with everyone's answers, especially since it seems to me that there is almost no abuse of protective armada of general ranking or team play during rounds etc...

I specify that this non penalizing abandonment is only possible during bonus rounds after the 16th, and that it allows to try bonus rounds until the final sacrifice, which besides impacts the ELO classification. But smart f...ing guys like UKR Secret.xxxx have found a way to change their name from an anonymous boat to an official secret.xxxxx boat name. He plays and loses, abandons without any impact on their official boat placed in the general classification of the challenge. In short, he makes believe that he plays the challenge when in fact he protects his acquired position by disrupting the following heats.

Exception of some UKR or Russian or sometimes even Italians who catch fire but that remains rare. A pirate from time to time and a disconnect sometimes.

So it is still as difficult for me to exceed 80-85 points, especially in 16 races.

so everything's fine... :$ 9_9

I have to admit, Mikle's screenshot is pretty exciting for me :x  

Thank you so much Mikle for this great moment of ephemeral glory... The next round I think I remember doing a pathetic 6 or 7 :S :D

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Il y a 22 heures, crapulle a dit :

And it should be a race after the 16th ...

17-race.jpg

DNF reduced my total points in the event.
What have I done wrong?

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Il y a 1 heure, Mikle a dit :

17-race.jpg

DNF reduced my total points in the event.
What have I done wrong?

You must stop definitively the challenge by a DNF ! and wait quietly for the next. You can’t make a new try except if it’s your own decision and a good calculation. It’s why some addict gamer continue to play with a second boat only for the fun or for bad reasons when they have a bad spirit.. (ie : protect his ranking by disturbing the game of good challengers).

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J'ai seulement regardé vos discussions, j'ai cessé depuis longtemps les courses ici grâce à des mecs comme lui, je ne reviendrai pas gâcher mon temps ici ni ailleurs, j'ai juste compris qu'il ne mérite que le goudron et les plumes: c'est laissemoigagner, je le connais et c'est un "TrollTricheur", une pourriture. 

I only watched your discussions, I've long stopped racing here with guys like him, I will not go back to waste my time here or anywhere else, I just realized he deserves only tar and feathers: he is "laissemoigagner"I know him and he is a "TrollCheater", a rottenness.

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Je pense que laissemoigagner n'a rien à voir avec ce file de discussion (qui me semble réglé, vu que Mikle a compris le truc). D'ailleurs,  laissemoigagner c'est qui ? C'est Bibiboat ? Boberack ? Le Godilleur ? Okvirtual ? NessCargo ? Le Joli Roger ? Bon c'est pas clair pour moi .... mais ils se ressemblent terriblement sur l'eau .... Ceci dit, en régate, tous ces bateaux sont plutôt correctes, mais je n'ai pas connu la préhistoire de VRI :)

epicure

Edited by crapulle

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A new kind of problem arose:
legalized "cheating" - tuning boats for money - is unacceptable when organizing fair events (championships, world cups - eSailing), IMHO.
Who does not agree with me and why?

:(

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I think most would agree especially it is rather expensive. i heard +200€ for level 15 but i may be mistaken. ( time 4... ) 

And please people don't try to tell me its the same for real boats. ( here it is purely artificial for the solo benefit of VR  )  that there is some form of monetisation i can understand but this is shameful.

And we are yet to see "stage 2", where new boat arrive, duration and content of f*** bucket changes,  or boat perf get devaluate (you kow virtual algua that slow you down)  and everyone is force time and time again to pay.

 

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and lol... 2015

7e77e41f2413852f6c9bc.png

but given the lack of decent SSL support... i guess it is 2015 in VR Office.

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Although i`m playing a lot, the rules are many times a surprise to me. It's close, but its not like real sailing. You have to adapt to it. There is no cheating, you just have to know the rules, which are sometimes confusing. I'm an active regatta sailor in real life, and i know the rules very well, with more than 30 years of experience. But, in the beginning i was very surprised with the interpretation of the rules in this game. Then i thought, just get used to it, learn them und use them. I don't understand this discussion about fair or unfair.  What is unfair to me, is the new upgrade system, which makes it just another game of spending money. You dont have to be skilled anymore to win, you just have to spend enough money. If you buy the full upgrades, you couls sail bavkward and still win the race. 

LEAMAUS alias Star 8512

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Le 30.4.2018 à 11:58, Mikle a dit :

A new kind of problem arose:
legalized "cheating" - tuning boats for money - is unacceptable when organizing fair events (championships, world cups - eSailing), IMHO.
Who does not agree with me and why?

:(

You are absoltuely right. If they don't change the system, it's not a game of skill, but of money . In real life, i'm an active Star sailor, with many years of experience in many classes, but only in classes where skills matters nad not the money. Sports to me is a competition of skill , not of money, but may be i'm old fashioned. I played virtual regatta a lot, also i agree to pay for it, but if they keep up with the upgrade system, i will stop playing.

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i think most of us are actually active/past sailors,  and most us willing to to pay some fair fee.

but yes people should compete equally and here it is shamefully not the case.  and it is not small money ( ~600 euros  for 4 boats ) 

sailing.org shoudl be deeply ashamed to be "partner in crime" with VR here.

VR can do as it please ( and will anyway ) but sailing.org should normaly have a better ethics compass here.

 

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Le 6.5.2018 à 12:25, L1 a dit :

i think most of us are actually active/past sailors,  and most us willing to to pay some fair fee.

but yes people should compete equally and here it is shamefully not the case.  and it is not small money ( ~600 euros  for 4 boats ) 

sailing.org shoudl be deeply ashamed to be "partner in crime" with VR here.

VR can do as it please ( and will anyway ) but sailing.org should normaly have a better ethics compass here.

 

i propose, to set a entrance fee to the races instead of the upgrade system. Then you decide how much you want to spend, but if you compete, at least its a fair game. I will quit playing VR.

I like the game, so i will check from time to time, if they will change towards a fairer, more sportive system.

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I will share my observations and conclusions.

The zero-level boats (standard) have the same speed and maneuverability characteristics. There is no doubt about this?
But boats of equal higher level (1-14) already have different characteristics !!! Even boats of the highest level (14) !!! ???
How did I find this? - According to the record time at finish shown by top racers, and comparing two own named boats. :)
My J70 boats have the same total upgrade level (9), but the opposite components are upwind and downwind (4+5+0 and 6+3+0). And their result at the finish is noticeably different!
Moreover, one of the boats has conflicting values of the parameters of the upgrade: instead of having the advantage of upwind speed, she does not have it, but she has an advantage on the run (downwind). Very strange ...

What conclusions?
Organizer consciously or not
- manipulates the levels/tables of the upgrade, assigns different performance to the boats;
- has the ability to selectively improve the characteristics of a particular boat (racer).
I consider this unacceptable and unjust in the conduct of the WS eSailing world championship!

We must convince the organizer to open all the cards.

---------

Several years ago I participated in offshore races, hoped to take prizes in the stages/legs.
But as soon as I found out the facts that the organizer started distributing preferences to his racers (he began to make changes in the forecast in their favor, artificially sink the other leaders of the race (DNF)) - I stopped participating, considering it dishonest...

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Yes  there ought to be transparency on what a 'CUBE' for every improvement of each boat is really doing, and there should be consistency across user.

 It is what people are paying - big buck - for. (and now very stupidly doing it blindsided).

There ought to be full transparency on every single race result per challenge... - and obviously for each challenge - but this is against every move VR as ever been doing.

One should also be able to see the split of improvement for other boat.

And sadly only sailing.org may impose it to VR,  but imho they don't have a clue of what VR is actually doing, nor do they care,  as they are proudly showing video of offshore to show inshore.

 

 

 

 

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Good to see you again Mikle 😊

Being a virtual sailor for more than 20 years and a WS race official, it's disappointing to see WS embrace this software for their official e-sports sailing competition. The least I would expect was the maneuverability of boats, the rules engine and the boat physics at least as good as what other sailing simulators have offered for many years already. And of course it has to be a one design, not the biggest wallet wins like the AC. Sure it would be acceptable with an entry fee, but then at a flat reasonable rate.

I understand it's hard to get in touch with the VR team, but I will at least get in touch with the WS committee, because this is ridiculous.

Edited by euphoria

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Actually VR downgraded the maneuverability when they adjusted for the eswc. 

I believe WS is thinking paid upgrades are only 'fair or ' color customization'' as per inaugural talk and not a must pay to win (more than 15% speed improprement - eg > 1nd ) that need 1,5year to achieve doing intense daily sailing in non paying mode.

in truth,  this is very dodgy and questionable behaviour from a body like ISAF.

 

 

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I have recently come across a "new kind" of cheating for me.... I have seen it happen to others and also to me. Most recently, a player got a penalty on rule 10 (port/starboard). The player then decided not to complete the course, but to ruin mine. He went on to disturb my wind for the rest of the race, hence significantly hurting my result. As he had not passed the buoys, he was "ghosted", so I could not do anything to make him go away. But his wind shadow still has an effect. As I said, I have seen this a few times this week (not before). Any idea what to do with this ? Its really despicable..

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Le 30/05/2018 à 14:11, euphoria a dit :

... I understand it's hard to get in touch with the VR team, but I will at least get in touch with the WS committee, because this is ridiculous.

I hope that reasonable people in the committee will fix it.

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This is some kind of mockery (VR's cheating)! - More than 15 races in Star class without a barrel/cans of 'GOLD':

It is impossible to gain gold for an upgrade... ((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((

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Le 08/06/2018 à 12:42, Hippocampe Fou a dit :

I have recently come across a "new kind" of cheating for me.... I have seen it happen to others and also to me. Most recently, a player got a penalty on rule 10 (port/starboard). The player then decided not to complete the course, but to ruin mine. He went on to disturb my wind for the rest of the race, hence significantly hurting my result. As he had not passed the buoys, he was "ghosted", so I could not do anything to make him go away. But his wind shadow still has an effect. As I said, I have seen this a few times this week (not before). Any idea what to do with this ? Its really despicable..

Same issue happened to me this week with a boat who ruined my race

Boat missing a gate, should not be allow to stop the race and only disturb other player

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Just had an unusual thing happen. I was way ahead of a following boat rounded top mark and gybed onto port. Also a second boat did the same after I gybed to cover  the immediately following boat and it was much further behind. there was no wind shadow indicated as the wind shadow option was activated. But in seconds they were both 50 plus metres ahead. It really seemed that there was some sort of cheating going on. Or was there some strange bug in the programme? Anyone else experienced this? I have noticed that very occasionally my boat slows down even tthough there is no wind speed change even when the vmg mode is activated.Puzzling?

Edited by Orca2 4-n
Spelling.
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