Rules are bad in this game!

[awkwardturtle]

Rule 18 doesn't apply and any boat sticking it inside from behind draws a penalty on the boat ahead inside at the zone! NEEDS TO BE FIXED!!!

[L1]

Not always but very often indeed. 

As well as a port boat may penalise a starboard board when approching the lower mark... 

and proper course is being applied in weird place.

funnily VR is fixing some of their rules but none of these. 

buth the weirdest currenlty is the bogus penalty system. 

 

[Mikle]

The implementation of Rule 18 in the simulator is a nightmare for VR and WS. 

[L1]

yep really really bad, Actually i think it was even better in previous version because right now even the standard 2 boat overlap, rooom to round is bogus.

but @[VR] Crew dont't care.

 

 

[Leamaus22]

The new upgrade system makes the game very unfair, as soon as you are willing to spend 4500 gold pieces in a major upgrade, you can sail backward and still win the race. I understand, that virtual regatta wants to make money with the game, but the step between the upgrades are too big. The winners of the last competitions had so much faster boats, that it is impossible with a normal boat to compete.

So, its a game of spending money now, not fun anymore. Pity!

[L1]

yes and it is not small money as you need 600€ to compete fairly... 

but here is a little secret,  VR dont care if you and i stop playing 

Edited May 6, 2018 by L1

[Mikle]

New shit rule - RRS 16.1

-------------------------

Who comes up with the interpretation of the rules, VR?
I want to see his face)))

[L1]

hi mikle, 16 was there already with its 15 infamous friend for quit some time. 

there are adjusting rules currently and its improving globally but as a side effect it looks like 16.1 got more "power". 

this will probably be adjusted down soon.

They want to improve their rules support so its should be for the best even if there is  (some ) room for improvement.  

my 2cts

[Boat23521]

Yep, good idea VR but it was too much on the changes to 15 & 16.1.

In between how it was before and how it is now would be best.

[SteveB]

The changes to the rules in the game have made some strange rulings to happen. I just had a penalty on the start line when I was on starboard tack and another boat was trying to cross in front of me on Port tack. Also, many times, at the start line, if someone runs into the back of me I get the penalty for 'acquiring right of way.' And this is when I haven't even deviated from my course. In a race I was just in, in the Star series, I rounded a buoy (well clear of it) and received a penalty from a boat that wasn't even there. Some people may have complained about the way the game interpreted rules before, but now it is just ridiculous. I mean, really, getting a penalty for being on starboard and hitting a boat that is trying to cross on port is just too much!!! And now, it seems, they are so confused about the rules, they stopped saying what the penalty was for (except for the 'acquiring right of way', which seems to applied at some very strange and unfair times) , and just put up the sign 'Penalty.' Please, tell us what the penalty was for.

Steve_NZ777

[Crofter]

Steve,

Regards knowing what rule was "judged" to be broken, there is a rule number posted below the clock and beside the penalty duration count down, as per this photo: www.www.dropbox.com/s/jegvur0kvnhuawa/R15.JPG?dl=0 . Has this now disappeared? (Play on iOS and haven't noticed if now removed?)

I have had P/S penalties off the start line twice, before and during the worlds qualifiers, so I don't think this is a new bug.

Rules engine bugs is the big topic. Sailx spent years refining theirs and it was still imperfect. The developers could consider telling the non-penalised boat what rule was judged to be infringed, and give the option of transferring the penalty if they deem it to be unfair/incorrect. But there is less of a community here, and no replays/fair play spirit/rules awareness here compared to sailx so I don't think many would feel compelled to transfer penalties.

[Jubilee]

Hi, Crofter

For your information,
I checked the display of the reason of penalty before starting ( attack to official boat )
and I could know the reason Rule No.31 ( Playing my mobile phone with Android OS ).

Jubilee (Japan)

[SteveB]

Le 07/01/2019 à 23:47, Crofter a dit :

Steve,

Regards knowing what rule was "judged" to be broken, there is a rule number posted below the clock and beside the penalty duration count down, as per this photo: www.www.dropbox.com/s/jegvur0kvnhuawa/R15.JPG?dl=0 . Has this now disappeared? (Play on iOS and haven't noticed if now removed?)

 

Thanks Crofter, I'll check it out. I haven't noticed the number before, I just saw previously the explanation was in the circle below the word 'Penalty.' I use chrome on windows.

One rule that seems to be coming up a lot at strange times is 'acquiring right of way.' Twice today I had someone run into the back of my boat on the start line and I was stung with that penalty.

Anyway, thanks for answering :)

See you on the water

Steve

[SteveB]

Thanks for the link Crofter, I just had a look and I see what you mean. I never noticed that before!

I better go get a penalty so I can have a look :)

[Imchen]

On 3/18/2018 at 6:37 PM, awkwardturtle said:

Rule 18 doesn't apply and any boat sticking it inside from behind draws a penalty on the boat ahead inside at the zone! NEEDS TO BE FIXED!!!

+1

 

[Imchen]

On 1/7/2019 at 9:10 AM, SteveB said:

really, getting a penalty for being on starboard and hitting a boat that is trying to cross on port is just too much!!!

Steve_NZ777

+1

had this a couple of times in the "offshore" class

spec. at the distance /runoff mark. a leeward boat does not make the mark, tacks onto port insiode the zone and on collision my boat is getting a rule 18 (mark room) penalty. ??

[emarckx]

I played/sailed on SailX for years. Semms they are bankrupt. Too bad. 

So, some rules should indeed be updated, not in the least Ruile 16.1. Being penalized by a leeward boat for Rule 11, which should be R16.1 is frustrating.....

By the way: happy to have found a new virtual sailing app.

[Crofter]

2 rules bugs I think should be addressed.

1. At the left leeward gate mark (looking upwind), 9 times out of 10 the inside boat will be penalised even if she is taking appropriate mark room. (This may happen on the right mark also, but I haven't experiences this so much recently.)

2. I think this is what emarck means. When 2 boats are overlapped on a beat, and the leeward boat presses Tack and hits windward just before she is head to wind, the windward is always penalised for 11 where it would usually be more fair for leeward to be given a 16.1. Sailx had a lot of issues with 11 vs 16.1, programming in reaction times etc, so I know it is hard.

[contingency]

today, playing against konadog, another canadian, i found myself directly behind him.

he luffed his sails and i hit him, getting penalized.

in the real world, that would have been a penalty as even though he would be the stand on boat and i would be the keep clear boat, i had 0 time to react. 0 time to keep clear.

room to keep clear is part of sailing and this game ought to incorporate that too.

Edited February 20, 2019 by contingency

[LaMerNoire - BSP]

hi contingency

in real life you announce a luff ... on that game, you just have to anticipate that the guy can hit you and you should stay clear before

[contingency]

13 hours ago, LaMerNoire - BSP said:

hi contingency

in real life you announce a luff ... on that game, you just have to anticipate that the guy can hit you and you should stay clear before

you're telling me that i should take action to stay clear, changing my proper course, so that i can avoid hitting someone that is clearly giving me no chance to respond and keep clear?

?

wouldn't that discourage close racing?

[SteveB]

Il y a 2 heures, contingency a dit :

you're telling me that i should take action to stay clear, changing my proper course, so that i can avoid hitting someone that is clearly giving me no chance to respond and keep clear?

?

wouldn't that discourage close racing?

Hi contingency, yes, of course, you have to plan and be prepared for every possible 'contingency'. It doesn't discourage close racing, it encourages smart racing.

[11962]

Sadly there are players who "exploit" the in game rule system and bugs and put penalties on their opponents every time they get a chance to do so.  Most of the top sailors can anticipate those situations and simply avoid them by tacking away or keeping distance. I don't think that's the way it should be, but if you think about the game as a game with its own rules "inspired" by the official racing rules instead of a simulator, you'll still enjoy it. 

[sean bond]

many esailors think about real sailing rules when they(we) play this game(i do also). still very hard to discuss about the rules when we play this game. but it’s also pretty hard to be a gentleman in this game when we want to win. every esailor knows there should be a manner for racing. VR TEAM know it and they have been struggling for this game getting better. let’s be patient and enjoy this game, Mr :) 

heating up is “the game” :) 

[Mikle]

Il y a 21 heures, sean bond a dit :

VR TEAM know it and they have been struggling for this game getting better. let’s be patient and enjoy this game, Mr

Fix bugs can be much faster if the goal is set... 

Something tells me that the improvements we will not wait.
As it happens with all tactical simulators ...
Let's be content with a novice simulation level! ?

[Cornes1985]

On 2/20/2019 at 3:26 AM, contingency said:

today, playing against konadog, another canadian, i found myself directly behind him.

he luffed his sails and i hit him, getting penalized.

in the real world, that would have been a penalty as even though he would be the stand on boat and i would be the keep clear boat, i had 0 time to react. 0 time to keep clear.

room to keep clear is part of sailing and this game ought to incorporate that too.

I had this today too, following behind in a a Star, they flogged sailed to stall, I hit clear astern with no reaction time and was penalised 

[Sisu]

Yeah, I'm all for a good luffing match, but there seems to be practically no recognition of Rule 16 (and often 15) by the rules engine. Try passing someone to windward and they just abruptly slam into you and draw a foul. Seems to be worst in the Star, where the distances are close and it's easy to luff all the way up because there's no spinnaker. Also, unless I'm missing something it doesn't handle Rule 18 correctly at leeward marks on opposite jibes, usually ruling in favor of the boat on starboard regardless of who had overlap.

It's a double-edged sword, but maybe this game should model collision physics (not damage, but definitely a speed hit). At least then, if you try to stick a penalty on someone you'll slow yourself down too.

Edited April 2, 2020 by Sisu

[SailChiTown]

On 4/1/2020 at 2:11 AM, Cornes1985 said:

I had this today too, following behind in a a Star, they flogged sailed to stall, I hit clear astern with no reaction time and was penalised 

this isn't illegal, the boat ahead is ROW and the only thing that protects the boat astern is a change of course. if all the boat does is luff sails and no change of course, you have to avoid and you don't get any RRS 16 protection.

the game rules, here, are working right. many other times, the rules engine sucks

[Sisu]

14 hours ago, SailChiTown said:

this isn't illegal, the boat ahead is ROW and the only thing that protects the boat astern is a change of course. if all the boat does is luff sails and no change of course, you have to avoid and you don't get any RRS 16 protection.

the game rules, here, are working right. many other times, the rules engine sucks

The key part of his statement was "with no reaction time." In this game the definition of "space to comply with her obligations under the rules ... while manoeuvring promptly" (room to keep clear) appears to be "enough time opportunity for someone with the reflexes of an elite fighter pilot to just barely be able to get out of the way."

[torsail]

Sisu - I agree rules 15, 16 and 18 (downwind) are the biggest rules problems.

Virtual Regatta - please fix this.  It's been far too long with no improvement in the rules engine.  Now with so many more players, a lot of people are learning bad lessons. 

World Sailing - you endorse this game, I emailed you about this months ago and received no response.  With no real world racing going on for a while, maybe it's time to fix the official game.

Edited April 14, 2020 by torsail

[regattaguru]

On 2/19/2019 at 11:26 PM, contingency said:

today, playing against konadog, another canadian, i found myself directly behind him.

he luffed his sails and i hit him, getting penalized.

in the real world, that would have been a penalty as even though he would be the stand on boat and i would be the keep clear boat, i had 0 time to react. 0 time to keep clear.

room to keep clear is part of sailing and this game ought to incorporate that too.

Room to keep clear only comes with a change of course, not speed.

[Sisu]

On 4/17/2020 at 8:57 PM, regattaguru said:

Room to keep clear only comes with a change of course, not speed.

Ok, I'll grant you that Rule 16 doesn't apply to speed changes, probably because the rule writers didn't anticipate the ability to slam on the brakes instantly by hitting the space bar. The fact remains that Rules 15 and 16 are enforced way too narrowly (though I did actually see 16 called in a race today).

My main gripe is the downwind Rule 18 port/starboard bug. That's such a basic, fundamental discrepancy that significantly alters strategy in the game. Also, the game doesn't apply Rule 18 to finish marks.

Edited April 21, 2020 by Sisu

[skutsje]

6 hours ago, Sisu said:

Also, the game doesn't apply Rule 18 to finish marks.

This is an important one.

[regattaguru]

23 hours ago, Sisu said:

Ok, I'll grant you that Rule 16 doesn't apply to speed changes, probably because the rule writers didn't anticipate the ability to slam on the brakes instantly by hitting the space bar. The fact remains that Rules 15 and 16 are enforced way too narrowly (though I did actually see 16 called in a race today).

My main gripe is the downwind Rule 18 port/starboard bug. That's such a basic, fundamental discrepancy that significantly alters strategy in the game. Also, the game doesn't apply Rule 18 to finish marks.

Agree about the rule 18 bugs. Very annoying. 

[Sisu]

I'm going to add room to duck from a leeward boat to my list of gripes. I don't know how I could have ducked any closer, and I still got flagged for touching the leeward boat. AUGH!!!

[PJ_CAN]

 

On 2/20/2019 at 12:59 AM, LaMerNoire - BSP said:

hi contingency

in real life you announce a luff ... on that game, you just have to anticipate that the guy can hit you and you should stay clear before

'Can and WILL hit you' and get away with it...

[Fast Tango]

This game should be fixed. I tacked a boat length   below a starboard tracker on the lay line and was penalized. I went from second to twelfth. Fucked game. This bullshit ruins the fun.

Also, they should have divisions novice, etc, so you can earn your way up to the harder classes.

 It’s a nice start but could be so much better. Someone with doesn’t know how to apply the complex rules. Someone can establish an overlap to leeward from behind, luff you up, and you geT penalized!